SARAH HIRSHLAND: We want to unite this country around Team USA in the pride of our nation, without a doubt. And I think, you know, I say to people, anyone who will listen to me: This is the only team we can all agree on, right? We love our sport in this country. This is the only team we all agree on.

BOB SAFIAN: That’s Sarah Hirshland, CEO of the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee. In anticipation of this summer’s Paris Olympics, Sarah returned to Rapid Response to give us a primer — breaking down the most important questions, stories, and events ahead of the opening ceremony. Sarah also opens up about the recent doping scandal to hit Chinese olympians, preparations for the 2028 Olympics in Los Angeles, and the controversial changes to the NCAA. Whether you’re a sports fan or not, Sarah shares valuable insights about preparing for a make-or-break moment, encouraging individualism while stressing team unity, and more. I’m Bob Safian, and this is Rapid Response. 

SAFIAN: I’m Bob Safian, and I’m here with Sarah Hirshland, the CEO of the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee. Sarah, it’s great to have you back on the show.

HIRSHLAND: Bob, it’s great to be back. 

SAFIAN: So, Paris is just around the corner. Are you excited? Are you nervous? I mean, you spend all year, multiple years to get to this point. What are you feeling?

HIRSHLAND: All of it. All the things. I’m feeling excited. I’m feeling anxious. I’m feeling nervous. I’m feeling hopeful. We’re prepared, and so it’s easy when you’re prepared to go into something to feel like now we’re hopeful that we get a little luck on our side, and this thing could be amazing.

Inside the U.S. Olympic Trials

SAFIAN: The Olympic trials have recently finished up, Team USA selecting its members. You’ve been through that drill before, but I’m sure every time is different. Are there things that have been memorable to you about this year’s trial season?

HIRSHLAND: Always. And, you know, I think the more each of us gets to know the people, the more invested you become in their success and their journey. And so, you know, I’ve been in this role now six years, and many of these athletes have become friends and people I admire and people I understand even more about how difficult their journey is. So you get invested in their success, for sure. And, you know, as you said, it’s always a little uncertain. And with trials, there are inevitably athletes who will make the team, and achieve for some a first-time dream. For others, they’re going back, and there will be those who don’t. So the trials are pretty gut-wrenching at times. 

SAFIAN: Are there any athletes who you had a particular engagement with during the trials, whether, an unexpected surprise or an unexpected disappointment? Like, are there any things that you’re thinking back on?

HIRSHLAND: Sometimes the ones who don’t make the team are the most gut-wrenching. And some super talented athletes may not make a team. We certainly saw that at the track and field trials in Eugene. We had an athlete who was extraordinary back in Tokyo at the games, who tripped in trials and won’t be competing in that event here in Paris, despite the fact that arguably she’s one of the most talented runners out there.

So it happens, and it is what makes sport a little unpredictable. But it’s also fun when you see someone like, you know, the young 16-year-old, also from track and field who will be the youngest male ever on the track and field side of things to make an Olympic team. And I spent a little bit of time with his parents, and they’re as wide-eyed as he is. So it’s fun. It’s really fun when you get a chance to do that. 

SAFIAN: You just got back from the gymnastics trials. Obviously the gymnastics community has dealt with a lot of adversity since the last trials. How did it feel to be there? Were there changes that you saw that you felt? 

HIRSHLAND: We were in a place not too many years back where we were genuinely evaluating whether the U.S. Gymnastics organization could regain the trust of its community. And this past weekend validated the answer to that unequivocally in my mind, which is they have done that.

We saw, you know, 15,000 people in the arena, 80 percent of them wearing some kind of red, white, and blue Team USA/USA Gymnastics apparel. And, you know, it’s a simple metric, but we don’t wear logos of something that we don’t believe in. So it’s really rewarding to know that we’ve learned, we’ve listened, we’ve evolved, and the community’s back. And then we saw some extraordinary performances on the field, which further validates that things happening in the offices are doing what they’re supposed to be doing.

Why Sarah Hirshland is encouraging brands to sponsor more athletes

SAFIAN: I recently read a blurb from you where you were encouraging brands to do more and sponsor more Olympic athletes. Can you explain why you felt the need to say that?

HIRSHLAND: Well, so many Olympic and Paralympic athletes are unknown to us, particularly in advance of the games, right? We don’t see archery competitions every day on television. I’m always wanting to encourage people to open the aperture to the number of incredible athletes who are the best in the world at what they do. But just because we don’t see them every day, it can be easy not to recognize that they’re there. These are individuals who have achieved something, of being the best at what they do that very few people ever achieve in their lifetime. And there’s something to be learned from these individuals. And there’s value to be garnered from their journeys, and the corporate community can and should leverage that in lots of ways. We tend to see a small handful of the ones we know the best showing up in TV commercials, and my push is to broaden your aperture and recognize that there’s 800 athletes who are going to come to Paris, who have achieved extraordinary things, and let’s celebrate all of them. 

What fans of Team USA should look out for

SAFIAN: For our listeners who are looking forward to the Paris games, what should we be watching for? Who should we watch for?

HIRSHLAND: You know, I was teasing my uncle the other day — 346 events at the Paris Olympics. That doesn’t even count the Paralympics. And the U.S., if history is any indication, will probably win somewhere north of 100 medals over 17 days. So, to say “what should we watch for?,” I look at it and say, “well, you should at least watch for the 100-plus medals over 17 days.” But that’s a lot to squeeze in. 

Certainly, America expects an extraordinary track and field team, an extraordinary swimming team, an extraordinary gymnastics team. We love our basketball. We’ll have four basketball teams this year: Two five-on-five, and two three-on-three. So I would call out to those who are basketball fans in this country to say: Hey, pay special attention to the three on three. It’s going to be a ton of fun. We love volleyball. We love our soccer. You know, the competition around the world is fierce in soccer. So those are hard ones to win for us.

Chinese swimmers testing positive for banned substances

SAFIAN: So I have to ask you about… I saw that Allison Schmitt and Michael Phelps were in Congress last week talking about drug testing and some Chinese swimmers testing positive for a performance enhancing drug called, I think, TMZ, without any repercussions. Like, how does that figure into sport integrity, and how much everybody can trust that this year’s results are going to be fair?

HIRSHLAND: Yeah, it’s maddening to all of us, as you can imagine, to think that athletes could be going to Paris without the confidence that they’re competing on a level playing field. And so we have to work hard, not just in the United States, but across the world to improve a system that is in place. But it’s not operating, I would say, at full capacity. And, we’re talking about 206 different countries, all of whom are supposed to live up to the same standards. And so it’s a difficult proposition. But it isn’t okay for athletes to be going uncertain about whether they’re competing on a, on a level and fair playing field, and that’s disappointing for sure.

SAFIAN: There’s a certain amount of trust, I guess, that becomes part of it because you can’t safeguard everything; you can’t test for everything. 

HIRSHLAND: Well, you just used the big word, the big word of the day, maybe the big word of the decade: ‘trust,’ right? And to what degree do we and can we trust? And who is it that we’re relying on to trust? We’re incredibly fortunate in the United States. We have an exceptional anti-doping system, and athletes in this country are held to an extraordinarily high standard. And we do have violations. It happens. It happens in the United States, and it happens in other places. The trick is to have a system that catches the bad actors, and weeds them out of the system, and doesn’t let them play. And that’s what we have to all count on. 

How the Olympics are a microcosm of the broader geopolitical environment

SAFIAN: As you were talking about the issue of trust, it made me think like, what do you think this year’s games mean for the United States, given where the brand of America is globally and domestically right now? Because the Olympics have an impact beyond just the athletes and the competition.

HIRSHLAND: Yeah, it really does. And, you know, I’m not sure I fully appreciated that six years ago when I took this role. It is in many ways kind of a microcosm of a much bigger and broader geopolitical environment. And so, we have to be conscious of all of that and celebrate the things that we should celebrate and be conscious and respectful of the places where we need to be a bit more humble. And we need to recognize where leadership is required, but how to do it in a way that brings others along.

SAFIAN: Do you feel like one of the goals for you is that everyone in the world, including Americans, look at the United States differently as a result of the games? And if so, like what would be different that you would want them to feel?

HIRSHLAND: Well, look, we want to unite this country around and behind Team USA in the pride of our nation, without a doubt. And I say to people, anyone who will listen to me —  this is the only team we can all agree on, right? We love our sport in this country. This is the only team we all agree on.

This group of Team USA athletes represents the diversity of our country. I hope everyone in the country can see themselves in one of these athletes and be motivated and inspired by that. And at the same time, the way we represent ourselves as a collective team reflects well on this country to others around the world. It reflects the excellence that we strive for as a country and have been able to achieve in many ways over decades, arguably hundreds of years. But at the same time, respect that we understand the obligation that comes with that kind of excellence and leadership and that we want to reach out and help others along the way.

Embracing individuality & unity at the same time

SAFIAN: I mean, It’s always been tricky. I think the relationship between the U.S. Olympic Paralympic Committee and the athletes… Some athletes want to use the Olympic platform to advocate for things, for societal issues, for change. But they’re also representing the country and not just themselves personally, and you’re like the keeper of those guardrails. How are you approaching that for Paris this time around?

HIRSHLAND: Yes and no. I wouldn’t call us a keeper of guardrails. But we’re a facilitator of being a bridge between those things, right? Everyone is an individual, and we want to embrace and celebrate who each of these Team USA athletes is as an individual and what they care about and what matters to them, while at the same time demonstrating what it can mean to be very individualistic and part of a team at the same time. But we view it as our obligation to help athletes understand the ramifications of decisions they might be making. 

We’re guests at the Olympic Games, just like every other country. We get an invitation, and that invitation comes and says, “we’d like you to send a delegation of U.S. athletes to these games as our guest.” And we, of course, accept that invitation. And when we accept that invitation, we also agree to be guests of that organization, and we have to abide by the rules and the framework that they set out. And there are ramifications if you don’t. And so our job isn’t to tell athletes what they can and can’t do. Our job is to help them understand the ramifications of different decisions they might want to make. And so they can make informed decisions, and we also want to celebrate who they are as people and what matters to them in the avenues that we have to do that.

And I mean, the best example I can think of is we have a number of athlete mothers and we’ve really done a lot to celebrate and let those women talk about what it means to be an athlete mother — in some ways the beauty of it and in many ways the challenges that they see and the gaps that exist in society around what that is and whether it’s healthcare, or child care, or stigmas around being an athlete mother. Those are stories we want and we encourage them to tell. 

SAFIAN: While Olympians aren’t employees of the U.S. Olympic Committee, this idea that Sarah’s talking about mirrors so much of what we’ve discussed in recent months on Rapid Response: the delicate balance in a company culture to encourage self-expression and being yourself, while also maintaining cohesion and brand unity. It’s not simple stuff.

After the break, Sarah gives us a sneak peek into preparations for the Los Angeles Olympics in 2028, and why the recent changes to the NCAA could, as she says, “crumble” the very fabric of collegiate sports as we know it. Stay with us. 

[AD BREAK]

Before the break, CEO of the US Olympic and Paralympic Committee, Sarah Hirshland, gave us a preview of what to expect in Paris. Now, Sarah takes us inside the planning for the 2028 Olympic games in Los Angeles, how the changing model of collegiate sports will impact the Olympics and America more broadly, and what will define success for Team USA this summer. Let’s jump back in.

Previewing the 2028 Olympic games in Los Angeles

The next Olympics in 2028 will be in Los Angeles, when you get to host. Now, I know that’s still a ways off, but are there things that you’re looking to learn from how the Paris games unfold? Are there things you want to test? Like how much do you use this as a lens for what you’re going to do four years from now?

HIRSHLAND: Enormously. We’ll test a million things in Paris, across every aspect of the organization. We don’t get the luxury of a cycle of tests and learning. We have these four-year cycles. So for us, we try to cram a lot of newness into each game, and then we have to learn as much as we can and we’ll deploy that in Los Angeles. All of that is to say, we’ll learn a lot in Paris, but to have a game on home soil is a completely different animal. We’ll use every minute of the next four years to get ourselves and more importantly, the country, ready to really embrace what it will be to have these games on U.S. soil again. 

SAFIAN: As you’re talking, it sounds like there’s pressure around the Paris games for sure for the athletes, and for the team, and for you. But compared to thinking about 2028, like it’s easier in some ways? When you look ahead to 2028, it’s a little bit like a lump in your throat, like, “oh boy, we’ve really got to hit the ball hard there?”

HIRSHLAND: 100%. It’s just more, I mean, you can go to a cocktail party at someone else’s house, and you still want to have a lovely time. You want to look nice. You want to be a good guest. That’s a little bit different than having a cocktail party at your own house. 

We look at it more from the perspective of: How do we galvanize the support of the country? How are we growing our fan base here at home? What can we learn around how we’re preparing athletes and teams for these games that’s going to make us even better? And we know that in Los Angeles, we’ll have the largest delegation, the largest team the U.S. has ever fielded for the games. And you want to make sure that if you’re going to show up to play, that you’re prepared to win. 

How the shifting NCAA financial model impacts Team USA

SAFIAN: I wanted to ask you about the shifting NCAA financial model for college athletes. It’s kind of a new complication. And I’m curious, as you look ahead to future games in 2028 or otherwise, like this paying of college athletes and the bridging of amateur and professional, what kind of impact do you think that’s going to have on the teams and on sport?

HIRSHLAND: Broadly, the education-based system is what created the success of sport in this country. And that started in elementary schools and high schools, and we always grew up with the opportunity to learn and participate in sport. The college system accelerated that to the elite and created incredible opportunities for athletes, and that’s been the envy of the world. And that system is being challenged and threatened in ways that we all have to be paying attention to. 

To anyone who will listen, we are saying don’t lose sight of the importance of broad-based sport on two things. Number one, Team USA and the development of our elite athletes in this country. And two, the health of youth sports. Because so many young people are participating in youth sports with the idea that one day, they might be a collegiate athlete. And if the collegiate system crumbles, youth sport will suffer and Team USA will suffer. And the development of human beings will suffer because sport is such an important part of the development of young people. 

SAFIAN: And what you’re worried about crumbling, if I can just make sure I understand it, is that, as dollars have to flow to add to certain kinds of athletes, there won’t be as much support for the broad group of collegiate athletes that aren’t those essentially superstars?

HIRSHLAND: The revenue from collegiate athletic departments is coming predominantly from football programs. And as those football players begin to share in that revenue stream — which, by the way, we support athletes sharing in the revenue — the challenge will be that the incremental funds now get pulled away from supporting the fencing team, and the rowing team, and the baseball team. 

SAFIAN: And when you have those discussions with the NCAA, with colleges, because the US Olympic Paralympic Committee has always had a degree of influence in collegiate sports… When you have those conversations, what do you hear back?

HIRSHLAND: Well, we’re all working together to try to identify what the new model will look like. We have conversations with athletic directors at the institution level, with the conference commissioners, and with the NCAA, to create a transformed model that will allow for broad-based sport on campus. While at the same time, providing greater benefits to those athletes who are contributing to the economic, sort of, machine that college football has become.

And so we’re all in conversations thinking about how you do this. And so what is the transition going to look like? We need to preserve the opportunity for athletes to generate earnings. Undoubtedly, while at the same time ensuring that there is some sense of structure that provides for both competitive equity and parity — that’s what makes sports interesting —-  but also protects the very athletes that we’re trying to foster and develop.

Why the U.S. Olympic Committee needs to scale

SAFIAN: So, you’ve been at the helm of the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee for five years. Your contract was just renewed through 2029. Congratulations. What’s surprised you the most over the first five years? 

HIRSHLAND: Looking back was a time of reacting to the circumstances around us. We were sitting amidst a crisis of this reckoning around abuse in sport. We were sitting in a time that was going to require significant change and listening to the world outside, and we needed to be reacting to that, and that’s one kind of leadership and one kind of sort of environment to operate in. 

Looking at the next five years, we are now really nicely positioned where we’re calling the plays. I describe it to my team as we’re playing offense now and that it’s a different kind of leadership. In some ways, it puts more pressure on you. but it’s way more fun, it’s quite likely here later this month that the IOC will award the United States the 2034 Winter Games back in Salt Lake City, which will put us at a place where from 2024 to 2034, we’ll host both the summer and winter games, and it will be a pretty extraordinary decade of sport. So we’re looking at this and saying in the next 10 years, we have an opportunity to reset what this broad base of sport means in this country. 

SAFIAN: Funding is such a critical part of being able to do that, having the resources behind it. How much of the next five years is about thinking about the funding model, the business model differently? And where might you go with that?

HIRSHLAND: Well, I mean, you’ve hit the nail on the head, right? We have to grow. The four-year period between now and LA will be a critical window for us to reinvent how we think about generating resources for Team USA, both philanthropic, which has become an increasingly significant part of our revenue, and also the business community, on the commercial side. And that’s a value exchange that, you know, it’s incumbent upon us to create great value for those businesses to be engaged and affiliated with us.

SAFIAN: Taking advantage of these big moments when there are games, but also figuring out how to stay in the conversation and create value and create opportunity in those quieter periods too, right?

HIRSHLAND: That’s exactly right. There’s a 365-day-a-year journey that all of these athletes are on. And there are heat moments. And we have to think about sustaining that energy through all of it.

What will define success for Team USA in Paris?

SAFIAN: What will define success for Team USA in Paris? 

HIRSHLAND: Well, the number of medals is an easy one. And so I won’t deny that we’ll be paying close attention to that. We certainly will. 

We’ll also look at the engagement of the American public across all the typical measures you would look at as a marketer. Certainly our partners at NBC will be watching viewership metrics, as everybody would there: digital metrics and social metrics.

And then some of what I’ll describe is maybe a little bit softer metrics, but we talked a lot about the integrity of sport and competition. And so, you know, we’ll evaluate the extent to which this experience for Team USA athletes feels fair. And does it feel inclusive? And does it feel safe? And are there measures around sort of that healthy sport culture that we can point to and say, is this going in the right direction as it relates to those things? Which matters.

SAFIAN: Sarah, this has been great. Thank you so much for doing it. 

HIRSHLAND: It’s my pleasure. And to you and all your listeners: Go Team USA!

SAFIAN: Sarah is a great example of a leader juggling what you can control versus what’s out of your hands. Her role comes with a lot of stakeholders, a lot of people to keep happy. She understands that to set yourself up for success, you need to prepare as much as possible. But crucially, that also means preparing for inevitable disappointments: that things won’t always go according to plan, and you’ll likely need to make some instinctual, game-time decisions. This, I think, is a great model for everyone in the business world. Just like Team USA, we should all be developing our own winning mindset and, even when we don’t take home gold, to learn lessons that will make us better in the future. I’m Bob Safian. Thanks for listening.