GaryVee wants your attention

Note: Transcripts are automatically generated from episode audio, and are not fully corrected for spelling, grammar, and formatting.

GARY VAYNERCHUK: Everybody on earth underestimates pop culture. Pop culture is a massive, massive currency.

I think businesses and brands have more permission to be contextual to the room they’re distributing the content in. When I make Facebook content, I’m thinking about parents. Those are going to be different videos that I’m putting into TikTok. Yet I believe most people are just making a video and then pushing them out.

Being happy is worth fighting for. The world is selling fear, brother. The world is weaponizing fear. The people who are most hurt and unhappy are very loud. I do feel a sense of responsibility for pushing optimism, happiness, joy. And VeeFriends is how I’m going to scale that.

BOB SAFIAN: That’s Gary Vaynerchuk, known by a sea of entrepreneurial acolytes as Gary Vee, founder of VaynerMedia, VaynerX, and author of bestselling books from Crush It to Jab Jab Jab Right Hook.

I’m Bob Safian, former editor of Fast Company, founder of the Flux Group, and host of Masters of Scale Rapid Response.

I wanted to talk to Gary because no one has commanded the entrepreneurial zeitgeist and played off of social media and pop culture more effectively or consistently than Gary.

This episode was recorded at the VaynerMedia offices in Manhattan, and features a classic Gary move of sharing a recent social post to illustrate a point about Taylor Swift and the NFL. 

His energy is effusive, passion for what he calls “day-trading attention” – the topic of a new book in the works — and for a new platform called VeeFriends that has evolved from NFTs to what he describes as Pokémon meets Sesame Street. 

Gary’s exhortations about embracing the new, while also embracing empathy, is instructive for a world that he says is too red and blue, when it should be purple. It’s just one of his colorful phrases.

Let’s get to it.

[AD BREAK]

SAFIAN: You ready? 

VAYNERCHUK: Yeah, I’m ready.

SAFIAN: You sure? 

VAYNERCHUK: I’m always sure.

SAFIAN: All right. I’m Bob Safian. I’m here with entrepreneur, author, founder of VaynerMedia, future owner of the New York Jets.

VAYNERCHUK: Very nice.

SAFIAN: At the VaynerMedia offices — the Igloo Conference room. Thanks for doing this, Gary.

VAYNERCHUK: Thanks for having me.

Copy LinkWhy GaryVee moves rapidly when he spots opportunity

SAFIAN: So the theme of this podcast is about “rapid response.” And you are like the epitome of the person who runs to the new with great gusto and energy. And I’m curious what “rapid response” means to you.

VAYNERCHUK: I think it means opportunity. I think it means curiosity. I think it means truth. I’m fascinated by people’s inability to get out of “no” culture.

I’m fascinated by putting your head in the sand. For years, I was a public figure, speaking of like, here’s an opportunity, here’s an opportunity, here’s an opportunity. I would wonder why people close to me, let alone the general audience, wouldn’t act on it. And it led me to realizing that people are insecure, or lack self-esteem, or really struggle with people’s judgment, or have these poor relationships with themselves. 

It’s funny, when you speak about rapid response, I think it means someone who lacks fear. Because the nature of running fast to something new is potentially scary. You may fail, you may waste your time, you may get burnt, but for me, it’s subconscious. It’s all I really know.

SAFIAN: And that’s not a bad thing to waste your time? I mean, you’re not really wasting your time.

VAYNERCHUK: Well, that’s my point. So many of my friends are like, you spent 30 hours digging into that hypothesis. Your time has become so valuable. Why are you doing that? I’m like, because if I’m right once every 45 times, it fully pays for everything else. I think people are incredibly good at academia, but not good at actual life. And so, I don’t see it as waste of times. Things I’ve learned going down rabbit holes became data points and context to other moments of going down rabbit holes. That allowed me to either bail early, pattern recognition, or triple down in an opportunity. And so I really don’t know how a CEO or entrepreneur sees the world in any other way. I feel like that’s their responsibility. The whole framework of this makes me think about comfort, fear, self-esteem, insecurity. Those are the things that pop up in my mind when I hear it.

SAFIAN: You’ve got a new book project.

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: Day Trading Attention. 

VAYNERCHUK: Yes. 

SAFIAN: You’ve done six business books before this? 

VAYNERCHUK: Mm-hm.

Copy LinkGaryVee on the craft of selling

SAFIAN: So why was this a rabbit hole that you decided to go down?

VAYNERCHUK: It’s the biggest conversation I see that’s universal. Whether you are a nonprofit, whether you are running for mayor, whether you are running a small business, whether you’re the CEO of a big company, a creator, an influencer, everyone is trying to figure out how to create demand.

When I say everyone’s selling something, I don’t see that as a negative. I mean, everyone’s trying to communicate something that matters to them. I think selling is very good when you believe in what you’re selling. I think if you’re part of a nonprofit curing a disease, that is incredibly good selling. And I also don’t begrudge someone who’s trying to sell lollipops. I did that in sixth grade. Everything’s allowed as long as you’re doing it the right way. And so, I believe that the world of marketing and communication has made a very aggressive turn. And I think people are struggling and wasting money on traditional and digital. I don’t think this is a digital versus traditional thing. I know, because I live it every day. You can waste an ungodly amount of money on influencers, on Facebook, on Instagram, on TikTok, on Spotify, just as easily as you can in a newspaper or billboard or radio.

And so I think the craft of being great at storytelling, running ads, creating content for the modern internet, being prepared for the AR/VR world of the next decade, the framework that makes sense to me is day trading attention, meaning, whether it’s a Super Bowl ad, which I think is underpriced for Fortune 500, or it’s a carousel ad on Instagram or LinkedIn, or it’s an emerging influencer on TikTok to make content for your local car wash business, or SaaS business that’s selling to Fortune 500 companies on LinkedIn. I think the nuances of communication and marketing have become so profoundly challenging, that most people are really struggling. And I’m very fortunate to be sitting in the eye of the storm. And I always get most excited when I think I’m writing a book that is going to lead to tens of thousands of emails of “thank you.”

And I’ve written a couple of those and I know what they feel like versus the other ones I’ve written that have less thank yous. I think this one’s going to be a big one. I think it’s a follow-up to Jab, Jab Jab, Right Hook, which was a big book that I wrote in 2013 that said, this is how you do content on social media. This one is probably the nerdiest book I’ve ever written. I’m a little worried that it may not be as commercially successful, cause it is a little textbooky. On the flip side, that’s what might make it very commercially successful. So I’ve definitely pushed myself to go further into going behind the cloak of what I do for a living, what we do for a living, why a lot of things work for me. I feel like I’m writing a book of the secret sauce that makes most of my stuff work. And I’m excited that people are going to take that baton and be able to build for themselves.

SAFIAN: There’s so many ways to reach people now, so many more ways than ever. And it sounds like you’re saying that people feel like, oh, I have to cover all the bases, as opposed to looking at each one as a marketplace and figuring out what the right opportunity is for you, for your brand, for your message, at that moment.

VAYNERCHUK: Period. There’s just so many examples I can give. If you are a florist, Instagram feels incredibly natural because a lot of people are there, but it’s also hard right now. The supply and demand of attention on Instagram makes it challenging.

Meanwhile, I know the cliche, the average, the typical florist is not thinking about LinkedIn. Meanwhile, LinkedIn is acting like Facebook in 2015, where on LinkedIn, if you post about floral arrangements or why you’re a good option for a corporate floral or just a one-off Valentine’s Day thing, it is more likely that you’ll get organic reach on LinkedIn than Instagram. I know that 99.9% of the people listening to this podcast would not believe that to be true, but I know it to be true. And there’s a hundred other things I’m thinking about or know to be true, and so I’m going to use this book to lay that out, but also get people into the right mindset which is, there’s attention and there’s filling that attention, this podcast.

The variable of success for me and for you is the words that come out of my mouth. The creative is the variable. If I give sharp insights, if I give things that bring people value, they will feel better towards me. So I think people are thinking about all these social networks as distribution, but not thinking about filling them with something that actually works. I believe that people are mainly mailing in the content. It’s inherently selfish. Look at me, follow me, buy from me. It’s incredibly repetitive. I look at brands and people every day. They’re saying the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over. That’s grounded in selfishness. And so, I don’t think people are strategic. I don’t think they understand the science around the art of making a picture or video work for you in YouTube, YouTube shorts, Facebook, Facebook reels, Facebook Messenger, WhatsApp, WhatsApp channel, Instagram channel. These are new things, broadcast channels, the carousel ad, the video, the reel versus the regular post. LinkedIn versus Twitter. Twitter versus Snapchat. Snapchat Discovery is where a lot of creators should be making content, but they’re only making it on Instagram and TikTok. So, in a lot of ways, the books I’ve been writing for the last, almost two decades, I feel like this is the 301 course. And I’m really, you probably can sense it, I’m really proud of it. It was really harder for me. I always am so ahead of things, that I can just spin it. But this one, I’m dreaming of someone right now who’s listening to this post, buying the book on Amazon, and a week later having 40 highlights in it.

All my books have done well. They’ve all been New York Times bestsellers, But I’m still getting emails about Jab Jab Jab Right Hook, even though a lot of the content is not as timely. I felt like I needed to do the updated version and the more advanced version. And so I’m excited. I’m really excited about it.

Copy Link“Pop culture is currency” — lessons from Taylor Swift/Travis Kelce 

SAFIAN: So, an attention question to ask you about.

VAYNERCHUK: Please. 

SAFIAN: So, Taylor Swift…

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: Travis Kelce…  

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: …have changed the NFL’s business.

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: Without the NFL being a part of its plan at all. 

VAYNERCHUK: That’s right. 

SAFIAN: What is the attention message from, I know you’re a big NFL fan. 

VAYNERCHUK: Yes, I am. 

SAFIAN: Is there a message in that about… 

VAYNERCHUK: Yes, of course there is. It’s actually one of the biggest parts of the book, which is that everybody on earth underestimates pop culture. Pop culture is the currency. Andy Warhol is a savant. He’s a genius. He was right. Pop culture is a massive, massive currency. And actually, this is really fun and we’ll do it in real time. Three or four posts earlier. Here we go. Where is it here?

F*** does Taylor Swift and Kelce have to do with me? Here’s what it has to do with you, Donnie, the mechanic? Attention is the number one asset. Just posting aimlessly a video or picture are getting harder to win, cause everyone is doing it. So now understanding the science behind the art. What’s the thumbnail look like? What’s your copy look like? What time do you post? How does TikTok work differently than Instagram?

It’s just so clear how hard it is to be great at social in 2024. And to be great, you’ve got to really know your craft. To actually realize… 

So I’m about to get into it, why I’m playing this for everybody. 

And this isn’t just being pretty or funny or just gimmicky anymore. You’ve got to get great at it. We call it at VaynerX: SOC, Strategic Organic Content. Strategic: why. I want everybody right now to ask themselves why they posted the last or the next post. And most of it is grounded in their subconscious. That’s something like this used to work and I want it to work in the algorithm. That’s not good enough anymore.

And then this whole philosophy is grounded in something we call PAC: Platforms and Culture, to really understanding the platforms, how YouTube Shorts works, but then also understanding culture, like why are corduroy hats? Why is everyone infatuated with Taylor Swift and Kelce, right? It’s not just two celebrities getting together, understanding the deeper meaning and understanding what that means to you and understanding is there anything for you to do about it? Let’s take that down to somebody who’s a mechanic right now, listening. **** does Taylor Swift and Kelce have to do with me? Here’s what it has to do with you, Donnie the mechanic. This morning, I see how many people now follow Kelce that didn’t a week ago. Those are people that didn’t know who that was. On the flip side for Taylor, there’s a lot of football fans who now know her a little more.

She had more awareness, right? Well, for Donnie the mechanic, that might mean in his local town in Detroit, he may want to go do a collaboration with a Thai restaurant, where maybe they cook a meal at the auto shop.

And so what happens is, when you understand, what happened with Taylor and Kelce is, they’re cross pollinating their platforms. So if you’re a mechanic in Detroit, like I said in this post on social, you’re not thinking about hitting up the Thai restaurant down the street, yet, that’s the kind of left field post that will get people’s attention. What if you’re lucky enough to have an employee that works for you, that’s first name is Travis, and another one that’s first name is Taylor? 

Literally, you’re a law firm, Travis Johnson, Taylor Smith. You can easily use the micro moment of the infatuation of our society to do something clever and silly. What people don’t realize is that little clever video on Instagram that only got 90 views, one of those 90 views is someone who’s actually considering to hire an attorney. And they actually like the fact that you were a little silly and not buttoned up and you made them feel more comfortable to reach out to you to work with your law firm or your dentist place. People are very linear. They don’t realize how big pop culture is and how they can factor into their boring business. I had a gentleman reach out to me who has, literally, I used a concrete cement business in one of my analogies.

He literally owned an asphalt business, started to make TikToks, even though he thought it was the wildest, craziest thing he’d ever heard, and it literally has doubled his business. An asphalt seller, the guy that comes and redoes your driveway, made a couple of tik toks. One went decent, another one went viral, and if I recall properly, a business that was doing $800,000 a year servicing a local area, I think he was in Wisconsin, is now doing 2.5 million. The tears were coming through the email. But most people who are listening to this podcast who are in a B2B or a different kind of business are not thinking how TikTok can work for them.

SAFIAN: And pop culture doesn’t necessarily mean that you need to have your celebrity endorser.

VAYNERCHUK: Correct.

SAFIAN: You’re playing off of what the conversations that are going on are.

VAYNERCHUK: It’s like being good at a cocktail party. Think of this as your social media marketing. You go out tonight and it’s a fundraiser of your local PTA or it’s the banquet for the high school basketball team. Are you the kind of person that comes to that event and you’re enjoyable to talk to and have a circle around you or are you in the corner by yourself? The reality is being an introvert and not being comfortable in that is incredibly appropriate and awesome. As a business, you’d like to think that you’re trying to market and get business. And so, to me, there’s so much more permission for creativity than people allow themselves. But people continue to wear their suit and tie in their LinkedIn profile. They don’t understand the room.

And I think businesses and brands have more permission to be contextual to the room they’re distributing the content in. When I make Facebook content, I’m thinking about parents, because I know the demo’s going to be older. Those are going to be different videos that I’m putting into TikTok, where I know they’re going to be youngsters. The words and the videos and the slang and everything I say and do is different. Yet I believe most people are just making a video and then pushing them out on these channels and expecting for it to succeed. They think of it as distribution. I think of it as a place you have to be contextual to win the room.

SAFIAN: Because it’s a conversation.

VAYNERCHUK: Before it even gets into a conversation, you can’t win when you’re a fish out of water. As a communicator, if you don’t know the room, you will lose. If you go give a commencement speech to a very conservative college and you sling unlimited liberal, it won’t land with those kids. And vice versa. If you’re a Jets fan like I am and you go to Boston and you shit on the Patriots, you’re going to lose some people. You’ve got to know the room. You’re raising capital from a VC firm that is very buttoned up, that’s a different presentation to an angel investor, who, they were all entrepreneurs and they built it themselves. If you do not know the slang, you will be out of place. And so, I believe, before it becomes a conversation, my friend, if you do not know what the picture and video needs to look like at 3:34 PM, on a Monday, in LinkedIn, which is mainly consumed by people who are at work, think about all the psychology that goes into this.

I’m posting different content when I know you’re at work, than when I’m posting on the weekend and knowing you might be skimming your LinkedIn real quick while you’re catching your kid’s baseball game and you’re bored. I reverse engineer the psychology of the person in the room, at the time that they consume the content. That level of thought, besides thinking what the thumbnail looks like, besides thinking what the first three seconds of the video has to be to even keep you to consume it. This is a level of science, in day trading attention, that I believe 99% are not executing on in social. And therein lies the opportunity and the vulnerability.

SAFIAN: I love Gary’s clarity about how much harder it is to be effective in our attention economy, but also how much untapped opportunity there is. 

After the break, Gary will talk about his latest entrepreneurial venture, VeeFriends, and about what makes the culture at VaynerMedia distinctive and instructive. We’ll be right back. 

[AD BREAK]

SAFIAN: Before the break, we heard Gary Vaynerchuk talk about how fear hampers leadership, and the untapped entrepreneurial potential in day trading attention.

Now, he talks about his newest venture, VeeFriends, and how it is scaling unconventionally.

He also talks about the culture at his biggest established business, VaynerMedia, and why no one at the company but him can fire anyone.

Plus, lessons about in-office versus remote work, and why happiness is worth fighting for.

SAFIAN: Can I ask you about VeeFriends? 

VAYNERCHUK: Please.

SAFIAN: I am fascinated by VeeFriends.

VAYNERCHUK: Thank you.

Copy LinkThe origins of VeeFriends: where “Sesame Street meets Pokémon”

SAFIAN: This started, at least when I first saw it, as NFT, and then collectibles, and toys, and clothing, and now there was a Halloween float. I saw you were on TV and a Halloween float. What is VeeFriends? Is it a promotional vehicle? Is it the next Pokémon or Disney?

VAYNERCHUK: Much more number two. I am loudly and quietly trying to build Sesame Street meets Pokémon. And I say loudly and then quietly… When I first launched it, NFT Summer, all the GaryVee of how I do things, I brought awareness to it, quietly. To your point, when I’m building out a Halloween parade float for New York City’s Halloween Big Bash, I didn’t overly promote that in my channels. I did it because I knew hundreds of thousands of people on the street were going to see the float and we’re going to hand out tchotchkes and cards and shirts. And I wanted to see organically what it was going to do. I’m working on YouTube Kids. I have a kid’s book coming out next year. I am 47, soon to be 48. I believe that you and I benefited from the content we consumed as a kid on television.

Not fully… there was plenty of silly stuff, but even if you go back to the eighties, when GI Joe did its cartoon, it had a message at the end. When Heman did its cartoon, it had a message at the end. Sesame Street. I will tell you when I started this, I thought I was building Disney. Now I know I’m building Sesame Street. Why? Because as I’ve been on this journey, I don’t think I understood or gave enough credit. And even though I follow pop culture, I’m incredibly impressed and humbled by what Jim Henson’s agenda was. I think he had great intent. Fraggle Rocks’ brief when they tried to create it… The brief was “stop war.” What greater mission could you have? I, as Gary Vee, am a character. I know who I am, but in all of my bravado and competitiveness and loudness and cursing and Jerseyness, for the ones that have looked closer, I’m really pushing empathy and patience and kindness and “nice guys finish first.” And there is a way to build a big empire, but doing it in a kind way and we need more compassion. And real leaders don’t yell at people, they capture the stress and they treat their people and you build up people and you play long. And life should not be transactional. 

I want to win. This is why I say Pokémon meets Sesame Street. I also believe we’ve lost our way in some of our warmth. I think it is bad to give kids eighth place trophies. I don’t think it teaches them about life. I think we’ve over coddled kids, we’ve created entitlement. I believe there’s a lot of anxiety. I have thousands of under 25 year old employees, or under 30. I believe a lot of them don’t have enough self-esteem because they’ve been over coddled, because everything’s been taken care of themselves. So using politics… red and blue. Vee Friends is purple.

I want to teach the world about purple. I think the competitive clown, I want to make him very famous and I want people to care about him, but he as a character is going to teach kids, winning and losing is good. And when you lose, you can learn from that. And by the way, if you’re seven and you lose, when you cry, when you lose, that’s not bad. It’s actually good. When parents say, what are you crying for? This doesn’t matter. For a seven year old, who’s got wiring of being competitive and ambitious, I promise you, it does matter. And I don’t think we should eliminate that from kids. And I think we haven’t found our equilibrium in modern parenting. 

So, VeeFriends is a collectible storytelling platform that I hope in 30 years will be in the conversation with the Marvels and the Pokémons and the Hello Kittys and the Sesame Streets. I want to build out these characters. Accountable Ant will teach kids and parents that accountability matters. If you blame the school for your kids’ problems or social media for your kids’ problems, you’re not setting them up for success. Patient Panda will teach people that patience is how you actually win. Everybody wants it now, now, now, which makes them shortcut, which is why people don’t achieve what they actually are capable of. So, what is VeeFriends? It’s an intellectual property.

SAFIAN: And as an entrepreneur, you said at one point you thought it was Disney. Now you think it’s Sesame Street. When you started this, was it just NFTs? Did you see the journey and how does the journey change?

VAYNERCHUK: Even if you look at my earliest content, I knew NFTs was a moment, similar to after school television. I viewed the NFT Summer. Don’t forget, I was making videos that said 99% of NFTs are going to zero. I knew what we were in, which is what Web 1.0 was in, in 97, 98. I knew the internet was going to be big, and the internet stocks and the internet companies were overvalued by short-term greed. Same with NFTs. But the technology’s real. Digital collectibles will be a part of everyone’s life. And that’s what VeeFriends are. They are digital collectibles. But I also want physical collectibles. The comic book, the trading cards, it’s a 360 figital IP. Fortnite is played as a video game digitally. But people buy Fortnite trading cards and Fortnite comic books and Fortnite hats. And I mean, Disney was digital, if you really think about it. It wasn’t really digital, but when Disney came out, that was cinema. But, you watched it on TV. You bought physical items. 

So for me, NFT hysteria, A, was an opportunity to create the original collectible. It’s really cool, just like owning the first comic book from Spider-Man, VeeFriends series one NFT is the original digital collectible. But now we’re expanding it. And I have a real purpose behind why the characters exist and it’s to scale me. I have done well and have amassed a nice audience. There’s a lot of people that value me, but there’s a lot of people that won’t consume me. I don’t look the part for them. There are plenty of people who don’t like cursing. I curse when I communicate. That eliminates me. I’m very hyper. Some people like a calmer soul. So my VeeFriends characters, my 250+ VeeFriends characters will allow me to put more love and kindness and accountability and hard work into the world. And that’s my plan.

Copy LinkThe challenges of remote work

SAFIAN: You mentioned the thousands of young people who work for you at Vayner.

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: And I’m curious about the cultural challenges of being a scaled business.

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: I know you’ve said you don’t want to be corporate. 

VAYNERCHUK: Yes.

SAFIAN: But you are corporate… 

VAYNERCHUK: Yes, I think that’s right.

SAFIAN: …with thousands of employees. And I guess how do you balance that and how does this sort of in-office, and out of office, work from office impact that?

VAYNERCHUK: First of all, the way to not be corporate is not to be corporate. VaynerMedia is a global advertising agency. Think Mad Men for 2024. We have 400 people in Asia, 300-400 people in Europe, a hundred people in LatAm. This is a global **** company. This is a big company we’ve been building. The way it ought to be corporate is not to be corporate. Here’s what I mean by that. I sign off on every firing in the entire company globally. There’s not one person in this company that can be fired without me signing off, because I’m scared that my leaders will do politics and corporate stuff, not human stuff. So as the checks and balances, I am literally the singular human being that has to sign off on any firing at VaynerMedia.

Not at VaynerX, cause there’s eight companies and there’s other CEOs, and I give them that latitude. But at VaynerMedia, literally no one could be let go. And by the way, 20% of the people that everybody else wanted to let go, is not let go, because I see something that feels corporate. So I think that’s just one of a hundred examples that… you don’t have to be corporate if you make weird family business decisions like I do. And I think it’s more scalable than people think. There’s a lot to it. 

Work from home is incredibly challenging. Building culture remotely is impossible. It’s very hard. We do a lot on virtual. As I sit here today being completely vulnerable, I do not have all the answers. We’re still in it. I don’t want to be the old man that says, “I used to walk home from school” and dictator everybody to be in the office five days a week when I see plenty of wonderful things from work from home: the work-life balance, I like that people are seeing their kids more. Like, I like a lot. 

On the flip side, it is very clear to me that the employees globally that are in the office are advancing past the ones that are not, because they’re winning on the biggest thing in an office. It’s called osmosis. The osmosis you get from learning from senior people who’ve done it… it’s profound. And so I’m incredibly challenged and crippled by this right now. I’m very worried about doing the wrong thing by my employees, who I’m not forcing to come into the office, when I’m watching their reports, eventually going to become their managers. We’re going to grow on merit. And so it’s a very challenging time for a lot of us leaders in figuring this out. But I do believe my intent is in a good place. I believe there are thousands of business owners out there that truly have good intent. It’s not some philosophical, emotional, like I want everybody in the office or the other way around. And so as long as I’m not delusionally emotional or ideologically emotional, the reason we have not set a firm, firm black and white policy yet at VaynerX around work from home is I’m still thinking. And I’m still watching. But yes, it is very hard to build community if everyone’s virtual.

SAFIAN: I saw a video you did recently, where you were kind of teasing a remote employee who was like, I don’t feel more connected. And you were kind of like…

VAYNERCHUK: Well, that’s the thing. On a one-to-one basis, I give the answers to employees in both directions. Literally in the last couple of weeks, I’ve had both sides of the pillow of the conversation. One employee saying to me that they’re stressed, because they feel like they’re underdelivering as a parent. And I said, take advantage of our policy. Don’t come to the office as much and pick up your kid at home and don’t schedule. I want my employees to be happy. And so, I don’t need them to be top performers. I’d prefer it. But you can’t be a top performer if you’re not happy. And so if this woman, who I’m thinking of, I pushed her very hard. I’m like, pick up your kid from school. It’s okay. Don’t do meetings from 4:15-4:30. You’re such a crazy worker.

You’re more than making it up. You’re not ripping us off. You’re not ripping your team off. Do that. And in a week, she was thrilled. And I was like, man, just that subtle tweak. And obviously you saw that other piece of content. Yeah. When I’m sitting with an employee on Zoom and they’re complaining that they feel disconnected and they’ve never been in the office in their two and a half years of working here, I’m like, it’s not like they’re in Ohio. The person that I was referring to is literally 18 minutes from the office and has never been here. Of course you feel disconnected. That’s not on me. That’s on you. 

So, this goes back to accountability. The world has become infatuated with fingers. We’ve become incredibly good at telling everybody what they’re bad at. And we do not look at ourselves. And so, yes, this young man, we had a nice conversation and I said it nicely. I was like, Hey, brother. You’re feeling disconnected in your house by yourself all day. Come in the office a little bit. You got it lucky. There’s people schlepping an hour and a half commuting here.

And he took that at heart and he sent me an email and said, I do feel it. Thank you for saying that. So, it’s back to purple.

The world is infatuated with red and blue, in every way, not just politically. And I’m trying to continue to champion for purple, because I think that’s where we find our happiness. I do think balance matters.

SAFIAN: But it’s complicated, right? 

VAYNERCHUK: It’s very complicated. But being happy is worth fighting for. When everyone’s like, ah, that’s hard. I’m like, it’s ******* worth fighting for. Don’t you want to have peace of mind? Aren’t you tired of being anxious? The world is selling fear, brother. The world is weaponizing fear. For the people out there who are listening, who feel happy, I mean it. Genuinely, you’re in a nice place. Please take it on yourself as a responsibility to maybe start posting a little bit more about happiness. I think the people who are most hurt and unhappy are very loud. And I feel the happy are staying in their inner circles and just letting their little family and circle be happy. I get a lot of ridicule, a lot of judgment. I deal with a lot of **** for being loud and out there, but I do feel a sense of responsibility for pushing optimism, practical optimism, happiness, joy, cause there’s a lot of it in the world as well. And VeeFriends is how I’m going to scale that. And I’m up for the challenge.

SAFIAN: Well, thanks for doing this, Gary, man.

VAYNERCHUK: Thank you.

SAFIAN: Really appreciate it, brother.

VAYNERCHUK: Cheers. 

SAFIAN: Do it again sometime, yeah?

VAYNERCHUK: I can’t wait.

SAFIAN: Gary’s messages are about diverging from the status quo, but not in a vacuum — that we need to react to the reality of the world around us, to do the hard work necessary to understand ever-changing areas, from the attention economy to workplace practices. And to always be mindful that our impulse to doubt ourselves is an anchor, and the antidote is what he calls “practical optimism.” 

I’m Bob Safian. Thanks for listening.